Zing: A Mission-Driven Approach to Aging

Summary

In this conversation, Janet Engel interviews Sally Duplantier, a gerontologist and founder of Zing, a mission-driven company aimed at helping older adults live their best lives.

Sally shares her journey of entrepreneurship, the evolution of Zing during the pandemic, and the importance of public health education and health equity.

They discuss the significance of healthy aging, the impact of Wellness Wednesdays, and the feedback from participants.

Sally emphasizes the need for a lifespan approach to healthy aging and the importance of community support.

The conversation also touches on personal insights into living with vitality, addressing grief and loss, and Sally's aspirations for the future of Zing.

Takeaways

Sally Duplantier has reinvented her career multiple times, leading to the creation of Zing.

Zing's mission is to help older adults live their best lives through education and support.

The pandemic forced Zing to adapt, leading to the creation of Wellness Wednesdays.

Wellness Wednesdays has grown to include over 15,000 participants from 57 countries.

Healthy aging is a lifelong journey, and it's never too late to start making positive changes.

80% of chronic diseases are linked to lifestyle choices, highlighting the importance of education.

Sally emphasizes the importance of community support and health equity in aging.

Participants of Wellness Wednesdays report increased awareness and motivation regarding their health.

Sally's personal approach to health includes prioritizing nutrition, movement, and sleep.

The conversation highlights the importance of addressing grief and loss as part of the aging process.

Sound Bites

"I started my first business when I was 28."
"Zing is a mission-driven company."
"You're never too old to make positive change."
"I love what I do."
"We're all getting older."
"You matter as an older adult."
"You have your own unique gift."
"Don't compare your gift to someone else's."

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Sally Duplantier and Zing
02:13 The Evolution of Zing During the Pandemic
04:54 Public Health Education and Health Equity
06:33 The Importance of Healthy Aging
09:15 Wellness Wednesdays: A New Approach to Health
14:25 Guest Highlights and Topics on Wellness Wednesdays
18:52 Exploring Peptide Therapy and Gut Health
22:38 Community Impact and Feedback from Participants
25:31 Global Perspectives on Aging
26:57 Living with Vitality: Sally's Personal Insights
31:30 Addressing Grief and Loss in Aging
36:34 Future Aspirations for Zing and Personal Growth

Transcript

Janet Engel (00:01.614)
Hello everyone and thank you for being with me today. I have a guest, her name is Sally Duplantier. She was on the show about a year ago and I'm so excited to have her back because Sally is a gerontologist, she's also a baby boomer and like many other baby boomers,

She has not retired. In fact, the way Sally describes it is she is on her third act. So Sally, tell us about yourself and tell us about Zing.

Sally Duplantier (00:37.589)
Janet, I am so delighted to be here, so excited. So I will begin by saying that I actually have retired twice. It just didn't stick. And so I started my first business when I was 28 years old. And it was in a very different space than what I'm in now as a gerontologist. It was in technology training and business process change. I grew into a multimillion dollar company.

sold it after 25 years and said I was never gonna work again. And then that lasted a few years. My husband's teenage boys came and moved in with us and I became a full-time, first-time mom in my 50s. But then when the oldest went off to college, I went back to work, this time in leadership development, very different field. And then I retired again. I have great pictures of my retirement party in 2018.

And then in 2019, I started Zing. And we'll dive more into it, but Zing is a mission-driven company. And my mission is to help older adults live their best lives long.

Janet Engel (01:49.656)
Well, I love that and that's a great mission. And I want to know more about how Zing has evolved since you started it, which was six years ago. And this was, I know it was right before the pandemic. So how has your vision for the company changed or evolved since then?

Sally Duplantier (02:13.777)
Yeah, so it's so interesting that you asked that because it's interesting starting a business that serves older adults and requires face time with older adults in a global pandemic. You know, it's like bad kind of timing for that. And so a few things happened when I started my business. One is I went back to graduate school because I needed, got a, ended up getting a master's of science in gerontology.

See, it's one thing to reinvent yourself and your career and start a mission-driven company, but then you need that experience. So one is I went back to school and that experience has helped shape SING, but also the pandemic shape SING. And one of the challenges I had, you know, I started the business in 2019 and in 2020, I was not able to go to senior living facilities and do presentations.

That was kind of how I was doing my marketing and establishing my company and doing education. And so that's when I invented Wellness Wednesdays, which was Zoom based. it was a way to, during the pandemic, help older adults stay healthy and connected. And it was born of necessity because nobody could, you we couldn't go to senior living facilities. All of the speaking engagements that I had lined up for,

2020, you know, they just all went away. And we can talk more about Wellness Wednesdays. These are evidence-based programs with expert, expert healthcare professionals, thought leaders, researchers, authors on topics related to healthy aging. What's funny is that my first program had six participants and my second one had nine.

And since then, we have had more than 15,000 registered participants from 57 countries.

Janet Engel (04:14.164)
that is amazing. That's amazing. It's, yeah. Such a testament to persistence and dedication.

Sally Duplantier (04:17.224)
It's amazing to me.

Sally Duplantier (04:25.629)
persistence, dedication, reinvention, know, like reinvention, because what else are you going to do? And I think what's interesting having been an entrepreneur pretty much all of my life, like you figure that stuff out. But I would say maybe the biggest change in my business, Zing, since I started in 2019, is it's bigger in terms of the overall mission.

I really thought when I started Zing that this was going to be kind of a nice little business. could coach some older adults. I was working with some couples at the time, husband, wife, teams, and you know, lifestyle choices to improve or promote healthy aging. But it's gotten so much bigger. It's really, my work is really around public health education because I don't charge for Wellness Wednesdays. I want to get the word out. So it's public health education.

It's also research based on, again, graduate school. you know, show me the evidence, not the blog du jour, not what, you know, Twitter or TikTok or whatever it says about, you know, eat this, not that, you know, the scientific evidence. And then the third one is really related to health equity. So I am partnering with quite a few different community partners, nonprofits.

that are working to address things like food insecurity, improve health behaviors, and mental wellbeing in underserved populations. So the mission is just bigger.

Janet Engel (06:04.03)
Well, that is great to hear because as someone who's a minority and who grew up amongst minorities, that is, it's very apparent to me, not apparent to other people who didn't grow up that way. And I was just thinking about that today this morning because I have become also very attuned to wellness and eating healthy.

Sally Duplantier (06:22.193)
Yeah.

Janet Engel (06:33.406)
because I'm going through perimenopause and this is when you start noticing that, boy, you your body just, even if you're exercising and you're watching what you eat, it's still going another direction and not the direction you want it to head in.

Sally Duplantier (06:50.299)
It changes. It changes. And you can weigh the same, but like stuff moves. It just moves.

Janet Engel (06:58.848)
Is that right? You don't look the same.

Sally Duplantier (07:02.057)
You don't look the same. you know, Janet, you bring up a really good point because I mentioned that I was doing research. So one of the studies I'm leading now is a qualitative research on what is healthy aging and what do patients want from their health care providers to age in a healthy way. And we're not just looking at people 65 and older. We interviewed for this qualitative research people who were aged 38 to 88.

We interviewed people in very different socioeconomic groups. And I would say something else that's evolving about Zing is more of a life span approach to healthy aging, because you're never too old to make positive change. But likewise, it's like a 401k plan. The earlier you start, the better. So if we can get more 40 year olds and 50 year olds thinking about healthy aging,

It's just going to improve the trajectory as they get older.

Janet Engel (08:03.756)
Yeah. And I would dare to say 30 year olds. I think that that's when in your 20s, there's a lot you can get away with. In your 30s, especially your late 30s, not so much. That's when things start showing up. It's what your lifestyle has been like in your 30s and 40s. It now starts to become apparent. And by the time you're in your late 40s, you really are

Sally Duplantier (08:07.197)
I would too.

Sally Duplantier (08:12.967)
Yeah.

Sally Duplantier (08:28.425)
Yeah.

Janet Engel (08:33.134)
starting to pay for whatever lifestyle you've had in terms of more doctors visits, more medications, know, diet, new diagnoses, things like that. And so

Sally Duplantier (08:47.209)
Yeah. And it's interesting you say this because 80 % of the chronic disease in this country is due to lifestyle choices. And that 80 % of chronic disease accounts for 90 % of the healthcare costs in this country. So part of it is, you know, part of it is educating people on what to do. And that's a lot of the work I do, the public health education, the evidence base.

Janet Engel (09:05.464)
Wow.

Sally Duplantier (09:15.133)
you know, what nutrition, movement, sleep, stress, social engagement. But then I think there's also a motivation factor because there's a gap between knowing and doing and actually applying it. And to your point, it's hard sometimes to get younger adults, you know, let's say in their late 30s, to pay attention to this because they still think they're young and healthy.

Janet Engel (09:39.502)
Right, because they haven't experienced, right, they aren't experiencing the negatives of, you know, not eating well, not exercising, or not to a great extent. And so I want to go back to what you were saying about Wellness Wednesdays, how it's become huge, it's evidence based, and something

Sally Duplantier (09:42.153)
It hasn't quite caught up yet. Yeah.

Janet Engel (10:07.182)
I, there was someone that I recognized that you've had on Wellness Wednesdays a couple of times, which I don't remember his name, but he is a very well-known physician that has to do with nutrition. And you had mentioned his name several times and he's been a guest on your show. And then I was watching Netflix.

and he was on one of the documentaries that I was watching. And I said, that's the man that Sally has had on her Wellness Wednesdays. What's his name?

Sally Duplantier (10:44.233)
Let me tell you about him, because this is such a great story. His name is Dr. Christopher Gardner, and he's actually a PhD. He'll distinguish that, not an MD. He says if somebody says, in an emergency, is there a doctor in the house? It's not him. He heads up the large-scale human nutrition studies at the Stanford Research Prevention Center.

Janet Engel (10:59.917)
No.

Sally Duplantier (11:08.915)
So he's known, he and his team are known for some of the largest nutrition studies in the world. And I met Dr. Gardner, remember I said when I started Zing, I needed more education. So first I started at Stanford and he was my professor for a certificate nutrition science course. And we got to be friends and colleagues. We worked together, we co-authored a paper on the link between diet and cognitive decline. And we just become good friends.

So he's been on my program since 2021. In fact, he's joining us on January 15th. But the study you refer to that was in Netflix was a study of identical twins. And one twin in the pair got a healthy omnivore diet. So healthy, but mediating. The other was on a vegan diet.

Janet Engel (11:55.085)
Yes.

Sally Duplantier (12:04.561)
And what they looked at were specific biomarkers related to heart health, even biological or even biological age, which is different than chronological age, and found that the vegan diet was healthier. Now, the key kind of takeaway from this, because it's not that you have to be vegan to be healthy, but the trend really in nutrition science is more plant forward diets.

less meat getting more of your protein and more of your nutrients from plants because they're just so darn good for you and we don't need enough of

Janet Engel (12:42.688)
And something that surprised me about that study, and you mentioned a few markers that they were looking at, but something else they looked at was, and I don't know how to term this correctly, but sexual desire or libido. And they found that people that consumed a plant-based diet had a much, much higher libido than people who consumed an.

Sally Duplantier (12:59.623)
Yeah.

Janet Engel (13:10.934)
I'm never his diet. And I thought that was very surprising. That was never something that...

Sally Duplantier (13:17.009)
No, that was surprising. then the other piece that was surprising was the findings on telomeres, because it was a short study. It was like less than 10 weeks. I think it might have only been eight weeks. But telomeres are the little end caps on your DNA. And they're a measure, when those end caps are long, they're like the covers of a shoelace. When they're long, it's like your DNA is thriving and dividing. And they actually showed in that eight weeks,

longer telomere length as measured in white blood cells with the people on the vegan diet.

Janet Engel (13:51.63)
Yes, I remember that. And I was very surprised by that, that in such a short period of time, you can have such a significant change at a cellular level.

Sally Duplantier (13:53.576)
Yeah.

Sally Duplantier (14:03.451)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it surprised Dr. Gartner and his team too. They're like, holy cow. So obviously it needs more research. It's one study, but it's an interesting finding.

Janet Engel (14:14.73)
Yes. So tell me more about Wellness Wednesdays because obviously most of us should be tuning in.

Sally Duplantier (14:25.223)
Well, yes. So Wellness Wednesdays, they're every month. You people can come to my website to find them. And, you know, we feature, I've had amazing guests. I'll just tell you some of my guests. they're topics related to not only to like lifestyle choices, but they're also related to topics like aging reimagined. Because one of the messages that I want people to hear

is that as an older adult, you're important, you matter. So like one of my guests was Ashton Applewhite. And Ashton Applewhite is probably the world's authority on anti-ageism. So, you know, so she was an amazing speaker. I've had Dr. Gardner, I've had Dr. Anna Lemke on, she's the author of

dopamine nation, you know, why do we continue to over consume things, whether it's social media or food? I recently had Dr. Lisa Genova, she's a neurologist, neuroscientist. She wrote the book Still Alice. We talked about memory and why it fails us and why it's not necessarily a sign of cognitive decline. So these are very eclectic topics. The webinars are now we're in length.

They're all recorded so that if people can't join real time, they can always get the recording and then they're free. So you get the link, you can share the link. Here's the thing people say, well, what's the business model there? So some people choose to sponsor me. So, you know, similar to like NPR radio, like, it's free for everyone, but if you like it, you can, you can sponsor. But you know what, Janet, here's the thing.

There are so many people who can't attend Wellness Wednesday. There's so many people who don't have access to healthy food or can't go to a gym or can't make the same choices that we can. So what I do for all of the sponsorship dollars that I get for Wellness Wednesday, I personally donate to Project Open Hand. And this is a nonprofit that provides medically tailored meals to sick and vulnerable seniors in the San Francisco Bay area.

Sally Duplantier (16:47.827)
So you see the greater good of Wellness Wednesday, it's not just public health, it's also nourishing those who need it. Because collectively, we've served, we've provided over a thousand meals to people in the California Bay area, people who might go hungry. I just, I don't know, I think that's so important and I love the fact that we're doing it together as a community.

Janet Engel (17:15.948)
Well, you must be very proud of that, Sally, and especially because it's serving older adults, which I think just like younger children don't deserve to be the victims of their own circumstances, and they often are.

Sally Duplantier (17:19.303)
I just, I love what I do. Yeah.

Sally Duplantier (17:34.173)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, like we're all getting older. We are all getting older. That's one thing. It's a, you know, good job being a gerontologist, guess, because we're all getting older. And I hope it shows, you know, I said I'm in my third act professionally, but I liked my other jobs and, I did very well in those, but I love what I do. And I wake up, I wake up every morning thinking, what difference can I make in the world?

Janet Engel (17:40.302)
you

Sally Duplantier (18:02.493)
And how can I work with others? I think that's maybe where I'm so excited about the work I'm doing with other community partners. You know, what can we do collectively to improve healthy aging in this country? And not just for people who can afford it, but people, you know, vulnerable and underserved populations. What can we do?

Janet Engel (18:24.002)
Yes, and I'm curious, Sally, have you had a specialist on your Wellness Wednesday webinar that has talked about peptide therapy? That's something that I'm educating myself on now, and I'm just flabbergasted at how it's changing wellness and how people are basically able to reverse.

time reverse the aging process.

Sally Duplantier (18:56.051)
You know, we have not had one specifically on peptide therapy. We did one that was extremely well received with an endocrinologist and we talked about the GLP-1 medications. know, GLP-1, like healthcare professionals think of it as great little peptides. So, GLP-1, you know, in your Wigovia or your Ozempic, I mean, is an example of a peptide and peptide therapy.

We have not done one more broadly based. It's a great idea.

Janet Engel (19:33.224)
suggests you do. just I'm learning about this one peptide that's called BP 157 and you can take it orally or it can be an injectable. It depends what you want to use it for but it has really helped people with gut issues like Crohn's disease, IBS and I'm sure as you know that

they're learning that the gut health is paramount, that it is one of the most important drivers of basically who you are, how you function. And so even if you don't have a disease like Crohn's disease or IBS or leaky gut, all of us benefit from having a healthier gut and a healthy microbiome. And this BP157 can

Sally Duplantier (20:11.305)
Yes.

Janet Engel (20:29.79)
repair the lining of the gut, but then it also contributes to angiogenesis, which is the creation of blood vessels. And so you'll produce collagen, so it'll help.

you look younger, but then also if you have inflammation in your body, like for example, as we get older, you know that we tend to have more arthritis. You know, if we did an action where there was a lot of repetitive movement, you know, you're gonna feel it more as you get older. Well, it can also help with those.

Sally Duplantier (20:56.039)
Yeah. Yeah.

Janet Engel (21:08.564)
Injuries and acute inflammation or someone that has surgery for example someone who's had a knee replacement or a hip replacement They can actually heal faster if they take this peptide and again, it can be taken orally or Injectable if you have a gut issue, it's more beneficial if you take the oral form if you have

a healing issue like having had a surgery or you have some kind of injury, then it's better if you take the injectable form because it's more bioavailable and you're going to get results faster.

Sally Duplantier (21:44.605)
Yeah.

Sally Duplantier (21:48.787)
So as a researcher, I will put on my research hat, I will look to see what clinical trials have been done on that. I'll look for the evidence and then from a Wellness Wednesday perspective, then I would look for speakers. But I'm always grounding everything we do on Wellness Wednesday in terms of what are the clinical trial data? So it's an interesting topic which we have not yet.

Janet Engel (22:10.798)
And there have been clinical trials with patients who've had Crohn's disease and IBS. So you will be able to find something out there. Okay, but moving on. Tell me more about housing. I know that you said it's helped older adults in this, how you give back.

Sally Duplantier (22:19.389)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Janet Engel (22:38.178)
to the community, to your own community, how else is it helping the participants that attend Wellness Wednesdays?

Sally Duplantier (22:49.245)
Yeah, and I can answer that based on feedback I receive from the participants themselves. So one of my kind of great pleasures is when people email me. like one week, I remember getting email from Australia, UK, I think it was Russia and India, you know, and I'm like, how did these people even find this program? But I get things from like San Jose, California too, you know, and I love getting all the messages.

What people are saying is that wellness, as a result of Wellness Wednesday, wellness is top of mind now for people. So in other words, know, might, gut health is a great example. We've done multiple programs on gut health. And what I find is, you you always want a fresh take, a fresh speaker, new ideas, new insights.

We evaluate Wellness Wednesdays in terms of did you learn one thing, new thing that you can apply? But it's also kind of the consistent reinforcement of the message, which is really around the importance of lifestyle choice to promote healthy aging that keeps it fun and centered. So it's like, let's say you were one of my participants, you attend Wellness Wednesday, you mark it on your calendar, you enjoy it, but maybe then you share the link with a friend.

Now you're talking about it with a friend. And I think that the other piece, so it's not just, you know, reinforcing lifestyle behaviors or, you know, teaching people something new about the scientific evidence, but it's also this idea that you matter as an older adult. Because in addition to Wellness Wednesdays, I write a blog, like this last one was about loneliness. It can be about kindness. It can be about never too old.

And that's also a key message. You're important. You're relevant. You're not invisible. And I think it's the combination of the kind of the scientific information as well as this, you know, you're relevant, you matter. That's helping improve the lives of older adults. And those are the email messages that I get.

Janet Engel (25:01.966)
Mm-hmm.

Janet Engel (25:10.222)
Now I'm curious, you said that you have people that attend in countries as far as India, Russia. How do you see aging is similar or different compared to the US?

Sally Duplantier (25:31.065)
That's such a great question. I really need to do more research about those different countries. You we know some of that from the Blue Zone research, which shows these different areas in the world, very different, even with different dietary patterns, cultural patterns, et cetera, where people live to a really long age and they live healthy. So, you know, there's longevity, it's how long you live, but then there's health span, which is kind of...

how well you live long. So we know some of that. What I have found in these other countries, again, based on more anecdotal information with people writing to me, is that they're hungry for this information. So, you I was working with a woman in India, for example, who just wanted additional resources. She's like, who else should I follow? What newsletters do you subscribe to?

So there was kind of a hunger for more of this evidence-based information.

Janet Engel (26:31.758)
And being that you are a baby boomer and you're living this, how do you, and with everything that you've learned throughout your life, but then also becoming a gerontologist and starting zing, what do you find are the biggest things that move the needle?

Sally Duplantier (26:36.477)
Yes.

Yes.

Janet Engel (26:57.644)
that help you live with so much vitality? Because I look at you, Sally, you're beautiful. I can tell that you take care of your body, you exercise, you look just, not only do you look great, but I can tell that you feel the same way inside. How do you do that? How do we do that?

Sally Duplantier (27:16.905)
Yeah. what makes a difference? So I mean, one of the things is I am my own lab experiment. know, in science, we talk about the N, you know, the number of research participants. Is it a study with, you know, 700? Is it with 70? Is it 7,000? Well, I'm kind of an N of one. So everything that I learn and teach, I try to apply. And then what's so funny with it, Janet, is that we're all human.

Like we're all, you know, like as much as I know about healthy eating and I know about, you know, I know what to eat, what not to eat, you know, like last night I had an Amy's frozen macaroni and cheese just cause I was too tired to make anything. And I think of that sometimes I think, I'm working so hard to serve this community. I'm eating frozen macaroni and cheese. So fun. Like that's okay. It is good. God, I love it. I love it.

Janet Engel (28:11.872)
And it's good too.

Sally Duplantier (28:15.907)
so, you know, so again, things that I prioritize the nutrition, the movement, you know, moving every day. have a wonderful dog who we, who has not barfed yet, but it could still happen. But you know, an hour of exercise, like real exercise every day, plus walking with her. I've really learned to prioritize sleep. that is just so important to us as we age. It's one of the most.

Janet Engel (28:36.846)
Mm-hmm.

Sally Duplantier (28:42.745)
things we can do. I say that sleep is like nature's garbage truck, but the garbage truck only comes at night. So it's fine to take a nap here and there, but like you really need that the seven to eight hours working on stress, working on ways to I can be just crazy busy. Social engagement that comes pretty naturally to me, so I'm very lucky with that. But then I think the other thing is that I really have a purpose.

Like I get up every day and I know that I'm going to have a chance to make a difference. And I think having a purpose, you know, you don't have to go back to graduate school in your sixties. You don't have to start a business, but we're never too old to make a difference in somebody's life. Even if it's being kind to one person or being kind to an animal.

or there's always something we can do. And I really believe that and I try to live that. And that's what keeps me going. So it's all of it.

Janet Engel (29:51.614)
I heard the Dalai Lama say in an interview that doing something for someone else is a selfish way of doing something for yourself because we actually benefit greatly from doing things for others, helping others. And so he says it's like a little secret, but if you want to help yourself, help others.

Sally Duplantier (30:20.265)
I couldn't agree more. So I am a donor for Ronald McDonald House Charities. And I also partner with them on some of their research. And I gave a presentation for them on why giving is good for your health. But it's really true. mean, you actually release, like when you give, when you help others, even hormones like oxytocin is released in the body.

when you're helping other people. So I love that quote. It's totally true.

Janet Engel (30:55.96)
Going back to your research-based programs, what has been your most interesting program that you felt like you had an aha moment and learned a lot and perhaps it also motivated you to?

make changes or implement that into your own life.

Sally Duplantier (31:30.675)
That, okay, that is a great question because I've had so many excellent speakers, but I'm going to tell you about one that stood out. And this was a really different Wellness Wednesday. I partnered with an amazing psychologist, clinical psychologist, and we talked about living with grief and loss.

And so many of my, like we've done the upside of stress, the joy of movement. I mean, we do a lot of joy and optimism because I'm kind of wired that way. I think I kind of have the polyanagene and we know optimism is good for our health. But I had, I'll tell you how this topic came to be. I was speaking at a senior living facility because I do a lot of in-person presentations in addition to Wellness Wednesday.

And a woman came up, I don't know, we were talking about, let's say nutrition. And she said, you know, Sally, I know that. She said, I understand everything you said and it's important. She said, but my husband died. My husband died a year ago and we moved to this facility, the senior living facility because of him, because he had Parkinson's disease. And now she said, I am living here alone and I never wanted to be here. And she said, why don't you talk about something real like living with.

with grief. And I just thought, well, why don't I? So I had to find a really special person. And Dr. Mark Moore out of Philadelphia, he was, I thought he was amazing. It wasn't a webinar. We just talked. We explored real topics and people were highly engaged, highly interactive. And I think, I think my takeaway was we looked at

How do we help somebody who's going through grief? Because you know, we never know what to say. Do you say something? Do you not say something? Do you pretend like it didn't happen? And that's what we talked about. So it was really practical.

Janet Engel (33:37.414)
Well, I didn't think you were going to say that. I'm glad that you thought that that was a significant one to share because grief is universal. Just like aging in place, which is my favorite topic.

Sally Duplantier (33:40.539)
No.

Janet Engel (33:57.774)
But grief is universal and it doesn't matter how old you are. But the reality is that as we get older we're going to experience more grief and it becomes

Sally Duplantier (34:07.891)
Yeah.

Janet Engel (34:10.478)
something that is very present in people's lives. I think about my mother, she was going to this senior community where they would have lunches every week and she made all these friends. And my mom is an introverted person, so she's friendly, but she's not the kind of person that will go out and make friends on purpose. And so the friendships that she had made

were very special to her. And I remember one day she came home telling me that this woman's husband had died. And I could tell that really affected her. And then she's had several girlfriends that have died. My mom's 78. So she's had several girlfriends that have died. And it just, I know she doesn't stop being surprised by it. Even though

Sally Duplantier (35:06.226)
Yeah.

Janet Engel (35:07.71)
It is more expected as we get older, but we don't think that our friends are going to not be here one day and it could be next week.

Sally Duplantier (35:22.289)
Yeah, yeah. And you know, what we kind of discovered in the conversation is people who said they were living in retirement communities. You know, one place had lost like 100 people in the time that she lived there. And she said that it wasn't like it was close friends, you're, excuse me, tail end of a cold. She said you're around, you're just around loss.

And so I think the reason that Wellness Wednesday stands out in my mind is that we were willing to tackle a really tough subject. Yeah.

Janet Engel (35:58.35)
Well, that's great. How do you see zing growing and evolving in the future? It has already evolved from what you thought it would be six years ago. And so now that you've gone through all this growth, how do you see it changing? Or can you even imagine?

Sometimes we don't even know how things are going to change. They just happen and then we evolve with the journey.

Sally Duplantier (36:34.119)
Yeah, well, I do have a vision for this. I have to cough one more time.

Sally Duplantier (36:47.049)
Okay, so remember, let's go back to school for a moment. Remember, I'm the person that went back to graduate school in my 60s. And what's kind of funny is that I was the only kid in my graduating class of 2022 who was also on Medicare. So, you know, it gives you that demographic. And I love school and I love learning and I love being associated with universities and I love research.

Janet Engel (37:05.803)
Okay.

Sally Duplantier (37:15.389)
So with all of that, I will tell you that I am applying for a doctorate program in public health. And I don't know if I'm going to get in. So I know I'm saying this and we're streaming this live. And so now I'm saying this publicly. I hope to get in and start in 2025. But if I can do that, it elevates what I'm doing to global public health leadership, because I think this is where I can play a role.

I talk a lot about how I'm educating older adults, but I'm working a lot more with healthcare providers. I'm a member of the American College of Lifestyle Medicine, for example, and I'm working more with healthcare providers, pharmacists, allied health professionals, physicians, helping educate them about the important role of lifestyle in terms of chronic disease. And so I think...

I think there's a larger opportunity to have greater impact in terms of improving healthy aging across the lifespan and again in diverse socioeconomic groups. So that's what I'm hoping. If I get in, I'll start in 2025, I will finish my dissertation and actually have my doctorate when I'm 74.

But Janet, you know what, I figure I'm gonna be 74 anyway, so why not have the doctorate?

Janet Engel (38:45.095)
even think you should have included a but in there and I'm going to be 74.

Sally Duplantier (38:48.466)
Hahaha!

And I'm going to be 74, you're right. I'm going to be 74. So what? And I guess maybe that's the other thing that I really try to do in my work is I try to model. I try to model never too old. You know, I didn't come up with that hashtag, but I think it really applies. I think too often, whether we're young or old, we let our own self-limiting beliefs get in our way of what we think is possible.

And like I said, I'm not telling everyone to go back to school and to start a business, but we can all, can, we're never too old to learn, to grow, to contribute, to make a difference in the world. We're just not. So like, let's, let's get out of our own way with respect to that.

Janet Engel (39:37.686)
Well, I love that and I will help you manifest that. I think that you're going to get in because any committee would be foolish to not allow someone like you to start the program that has accomplished so much.

Sally Duplantier (39:53.287)
Well, thank you. That's what my references say and my friends and colleagues. we will see. I will tell you as an entrepreneur, I'm a little bit like I'm a non-traditional fit for the program. And I know, if I don't get in, I know I'm still going to make a difference. But I'm excited about this opportunity.

Janet Engel (40:16.204)
When will you find out?

Sally Duplantier (40:18.013)
Well, hopefully, I'll by February. So I'll know relatively soon in a couple of months.

Janet Engel (40:24.212)
Okay, well, I really hope that what you want and what you need happens. And it was such a pleasure to talk to you, Sally. I really believe that all of us, especially women, can learn so much from you that we can continue to grow and evolve as our lives change.

Sally Duplantier (40:32.787)
Thank you. Thank you.

Janet Engel (40:53.388)
you know, with women, especially women, like you said, you had your children, they came into your life later in life, but then when they left, you still had a whole life. And I think that a lot of women need to be.

reminded of that, that it doesn't matter how old you are, you can still do great things and you can start new things and you can do things that have nothing to do with what you've done in the past. I always said, and I learned this from working with people because I worked with hundreds of people, thousands of people as an occupational therapist and had the opportunity to meet people from all walks of life, all ages.

This is the one thing I learned is everyone has a gift and most people have three or four gifts or more. And so we just have to tap into that and explore what those gifts are and develop them. We may not have had lives that nurtured those gifts, but that doesn't mean that we can't change that.

Sally Duplantier (42:05.033)
Yeah. And I think what you said is super important. Maybe, you know, like as, as we end, it's like, don't compare your gift to someone else's, you know, I mean, I look at people who are in their nineties and running marathons. I'll tell you what, Janet, that's not me. I mean, that just isn't. So don't, don't limit our belief in ourselves because, I'm not Sally or I'm not Janet or I'm not Hillary or whomever. So what? You have your own.

unique gift. Absolutely. I love that. I love that.

Janet Engel (42:36.141)
Right.

Yeah, so let's end on that note. And you know what? I think it's a perfect

Sally Duplantier (42:42.395)
All right. Thank you.

Sally Duplantier (43:37.5)
Yeah.

Sally Duplantier (44:01.521)
Yeah. Thank you so much for having me on your program. It is always a delight to talk to you, Janet.

Sally Duplantier (44:10.601)
Happy holidays to you too.